Hydraulic gear on a Cruiseair

M

McCruisair

New member
Friends..and I know you are my friends...as someone used to say on the radio long ago...I am still trying to accumulate the necessary parts for Hydraulic gear on my 14-13. My bicycle chain gear is working fine but I'm just about wore out. I have most of the needed components except that I need the adel relief valve. Can anyone steer me in the proper direction? I would sure appreciate it
Mike McDonald
N86744
 
Mike, I just pulled out the blueprint for the Kidwell hydraulic gear and it shows a Vector Products relief valve, and gives a part number that is unreadable, and says "Or Equivalent" and set to 900 PSI. Since you are probably going to have to do it on a field approval, it wont make much difference as long as it is an aviation relief valve. At least that is my guess. I dont even know if our hand pumps will go to 900 PSI. I have blueprints for both the Kidwell gear and the Snow(A.T.C.) gear, so if I can help, just let me know. If you have any of the printed installation instructions I would be very interested in seeing a copy.____Grant.
 
Grant,

Thanks for the answer. I hadn't checked the forum or I would have thanked you sooner. I have a copy of Mike Grimes 337 and he told me the same thing..that any relief valve would probabably do. I guess I should have asked him earlier.
Mike
 
Mike, I have changed my mind about the hand pump pressure since my last post. I discovered a badly broken bracket that holds the rear of the hydraulic cylinder to the rear spar. The only thing I can think of is that I have been pumping too hard when the gear settles into the wheel well. The Kidwell STC doesnt have a pressure gauge so I dont know what I have been pumping. I am certainly going to install a gauge soon, and pull my relieve valve and check it. A long time ago I saw a landing check list that had (check for 500 PSI on downwind). I dont know if that came from the original STC instructions or from some standard procedure. I dont think it should take very much pressure to keep the gear up. The bracket in question is built to take a lot of push, but not very strong if it is pulled on. The other STC shows a gauge on the prints. Good Luck with the conversion.___Grant.
 
Thanks Grant,

I could send you a copy of the 337 that I have from Mike Grimes..it has some specs on a pressure guage and the relief gauge. It refrerences Kidwell parts ..so you probably have it but ..My email is Retour@aol.com..send me yours and I will send it along
thanks again for the info

Mike
 
Thanks for the offer. I already have Mike Grimes 337. I ran into a friend today that used to own a Cruisair with Kidwell gear, and his did have a gauge. He said his normal pressures were 900 PSI . I cant help but think 900 is more than needed, especially in the up position. Somewhere in my files I have a bunch of old 337s on hydraulic gear. I think I will dig them out and see if any stated a normal working pressure. Good Luck_____Grant.
 
Since You're looking Grant...I would appreciate any advise you or larry could give me...... I'm hoping this wont take too long to finish but I know how these things go

Mike
 
As an aside to this thread some of you may be interested in some information on Slim Kidwell, the developer of this gear system and an old time Bellanca dealer. I knew Slim towards the end of his life and built a hangar on a residential lot at his airport.

See: http://www.quehoposse.org/calnevari.html or Google 'Slim Kidwell' for more links.

Bob "O-ring" Seals
 
Bob, do you have any idea who owns the rights to the Kidwell STCs? I understand that he held a number of STCs for the Cruisair, and they might be a big help to the Bellanca community .I have been told that his widow still owns a Casino in Nevada, and she might be the legal owner of them. It would be great to revive some of these old but good STCs.____Grant.
 
McCruisair Mike, I will dust of my microfitch reader and try to find all the variations of the hydraulic gear.There have been numerous pumps used and many different relieve valves. There have been a few approved with an electric pump, but it is so easy with the hand pump that I dont think it would be worth the cost and weight. The Snow STC ( Aircraft Technical Service) is better in that you modify your 14 13 retract struts rather than trying to locate 14 19 2 struts, but it has an accumulator in the system which I think is an accident waiting to happen on the ground if your pant leg catches the valve or you make a mistake and move the valve on the ground.The kidwell system will just go limp, but stay down. It might take me a week or so to get all the info._____Grant.
 
Mike, I looked over a number of 337s, and Mike Grimes is the best. I agree with his pressures of 600 PSI for the relief valve. I think the 900 PSI recommended by Kidwell is more than needed. Do you have the Kidwell print, or the ATC print? I can send you a copy if you need it. If you are doing this on a field approval you might want to look at Viking hydraulic cylinders ,since they have an adjustable end. They need some lathe work on one internal part, but the adjustment is nice. Let me (and the rest of us) know what you need and maybe we can help more._____Grant.
 
Hey Grant...I sure appreciate your replys. I have an Adel hydraulic pump, It looks like the same pump that Oz Levi has but the discharge is in front and I think Oz's is in back..I'm not thinking thats a big deal..Two Hydraulic cylinders..I'm not sure which they are and I understand that there is some fitting to do. I also have the landing gear actuator..or at least I am in the process of dickering over it with Mike Grimes. I am going to modify my existing retract struts..I can't remember what Mikes 337 says but thats what he did as well. I don't have the over center springs ...Mike says that he bought his from Bellanca...he did his a long time ago..are they available..is that where you got yours? I also am still trying to come up with the necessary check valve and the relief valve. I'm just drawing a blank on finding them.. But! I'm moving along on the project..I have the chain drive components out and all the cuts and scratches that go along with that job. I guess I should have done all this stuff prior to annual..I only flew the airplane one time after the last annual and that was to Columbia..but that cranking was just getting to be too big of chore and the other Cruiseairs all had the hydraulic gear so I decided it was time to bite the bullet..I would sure like to look at any print you have...

Thanks again,
Mike
 
Mike, give me a mailing address and I will send a Kidwell blue print and some small drawings of the ATC gear. I cant locate the large ATC print right now, but the small ones show the proper way to modify your 14-13 retract struts. With the ATC mods you dont have to change your rear spar brackets to 14-19 parts which are hard to locate. The prints also show how to make the down springs, and all the other small brackets.______Grant.
 
Hi. Just re-joined the Bellanca Club again after many years of ignoring my ol' 14-13-2.

It has the Kidwell gear, one of the very nicest things about the plane. I hope to start working on it soon and have it flying in a few months. I have no documents on the gear mod, just a logbook notation .( the plane was rebilt as a school project in the LA area in the 60's)

Glad there are a few kindred souls here for 14-13 support. I'll be around to contribute if I can help.

Ron Marks, Moreno Valley, ca
 
Larry, I mailed you the Mike Grimes micro fitch today. It covers the 220 Franklin,Cleavelands, and the gear. It is very well written.____Grant
 
Grant, thank you very much for the offer to send me the info..My Mailing address is
Mike McDonald
PObox 1193 Littlerock CA.
93543

Please allow me to pay for the cost of sending the information

Mike
 
Grant, thanks very much for sending me all that information...that was really very nice of you. I hope I can make it up to you. I see that you mentioned that accumulator and I can't help but think that's not really a good idea..do you know anyone else who has that in their system?
I"m going to have questions so I hope I don't burn anyone out.....

Mike
 
gjordan said:
Mike, I have changed my mind about the hand pump pressure since my last post. I discovered a badly broken bracket that holds the rear of the hydraulic cylinder to the rear spar. The only thing I can think of is that I have been pumping too hard when the gear settles into the wheel well.

Grant and Larry and all....a question..how difficult is it to pump the gear up?..do you seem to have a hard spot half way thru the up opperation. When I operated Oz Levi's in the past I didn't think there was a great deal of effort required, but today I pumped his gear up during a ground check and it seemed to take quite a bit of umph... Just wondering?
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