Overhaul Stuff

glennhake

New member
Well, I missed a summer of fly-ins while overhauling my engine. The reason I overhauled it was because it had been 35 yrs since the last overhaul and Continental recommends 11 years. I had over 1800 hrs on the 1500 recommended TBO engine. This annual I had 3 cylinders with low compression, 2 cylinders were due to worn valve guides, and one was through the rings. With my luck, if I repaired the cylinders, something would go wrong with the bottom end the next year, so after 20 years of trouble free operation I decided to bite the bullet and overhaul the thing with a local reputable overhaul shop. I also overhauled all the components firewall forward. Some stuff I learned.

1. You can stand a lot of gaging as you write checks
2. I've attended seminars by this guy:

http://www.avweb.com/news/maint/182849-1.html

One thing he said was don't go into the bottom end for a top end problem. There should be some indication the bottom end is deteriorating before going into it. Turns out he was right on my engine. The bottom end was close to new tolerances, I could have gotten away with just repairing the cylinders with 20/20 hindsight. I just ran out of guts.

3. I bought a wiz bang JPI EDM 700 engine analyzer so I could monitor cylinder head temps and lean to perfection. So far that's been a waste. Cylinder temp have been 350+/- 20 degrees. When I lean by ear or use the EDM 700 I get there same results. I figure the thing might pay for its self if a cylinder starts to act up however, and thought that might be a possibility during break-in. The EDM 700 includes a voltage read out which is nice. The component shop set voltage regulator/generator to 14.2 volts. It's running between 14.1 and 14.4 volts on the plane according to theEDM 700, more info than I want to know. I also bought the fuel flow option. When I first ran the engine there was quite a bit of air in the line. Fuel flow was unreadable. As the system purged itself fuel flow settled down quite a bit. Now it varies +/- .3 lbs per hour. I've never gotten rock solid indications like I'd expect. Fuel pressure is rock solid. The system also has a computer to enter total fuel, it then tracks fuel used and remaining. That part of the system has been accurate to .1 gallons/40 gallons consumed. Wiz bang!

4. I initially decided to go with Continental cylinders because the shop had no preference and I figured Continental ought to have cylinders figured out by now. Lynn suggested I go with ECI cylinders because he had good luck with them on his plane. His experience with oil consumption has been good since his top. After asking lots of questions I stumble across a few people that said Continental cylinders have steel barrels which are slightly prone to corrosion if the engine sits around a bit. The Nickel coating on the ECI Titan cylinders won't rust. The last 2 winters we've been snowed in forcing a 3 month period of no flying. For that reason and Lynn’s recommendation I decided to go with ECI. I burned almost quart the first flight hour. The next 8 hours I've burned .2 quarts on the dip stick. It looks like the engine won't require any oil between oil changes. That'll be a new experience after burning a qt every 3.5 hours the last 20 years.

5. The last 20+ years my engine has started reliably with the starter rocking through one compression stroke at a time. Cleaned all the contacts, overhauled the start with minimal change. A couple of years ago change from the G-35 to a C-35 battery. According to the specs the Concord has more cranking power. That helped some. I figured that on an engine with good compression I'd probably be lucky to start it. Change to the latest version of the sky-tec starter. The engine spins like normal. I still have the original aluminum rod as a cable.

6. There are a lot of hoses, wires, fuel lines, and cables in close proximity under that firewall. From the last time I had the engine off I knew there was a chance stuff could rub and if not found potentially cause bad things. Hopefully, with 2 sets of eyes we've found everything by now. All minor things, but we missed stuff or found things shifted and settle to new places the first 2 or 3 runs when we looked the installation over.


7. According to the electronic through the windshield tach, I’ve been running the engine 130 RPM faster than I thought the last 20 years. That tach error made already scary fuel flows scarier during initial engine runs. Who knows how accurate the MP gage is.

I’m sure the group would be interested if you have comment, opinions, thoughts or questions.
 
Glenn, great to see you back on the ready board. I'm sure you will be happy with your new engine. I have done 6 engines including mine with the ECI Titans and none of them use any oil(less than a 1/4 qt) between changes,(25 hr with filter). A friend of mine did his 182 last year with factory cyl and he is NOT HAPPY. I told him so but NO he wouldn't listen. Now it is for sale. I have 1000 hrs smoh so I got a few more years and hrs to go. I change oil and filter every 25 hrs. I use straight wt Aeroshell 100 or 80 and Champion filters. The plane is fine, it is me that I worry about! Lynn the crate :roll:
 
Thanks Glenn;
My son Peter is going thru the same now, but his (new to him) 14-19-3a's engine sat for 15 years while yours ran. Completely different result. He has to replace everything but the cases, cylinders and oil pan. :(
Thanks for the info, keep it comming.
 
Glenn, I was thinking of your JPI engine analyser. I'm putting a Electronics Int, UBG16 in a Turbo Arrow. This guy got all the whistles and lights and bells. The thing has a million wires, sensors and data recorder. So far I got 11 hrs into this and all that just to drill and mount the instrument, lights and switches. He paid 1600 bucks for this and it will cost him at least that for me to install it. The big laugh is with all this data loading this guy doesn't have a computer! These guys are super salesmen. All this thing is going to do is cause him to worry ie is that a normal reading etc. One nice thing about EI is they have a very helpful, friendly tech support. I didn't press 1 for English and I was talking to Oregon, USA. Lynn the crate :lol:
 
Talked to a few salesmen at OSH but relied mostly on technical data on their websites to make the JPI decision. Both units are very competitive and I think the best is a personal call. I believe my mechanic and I had about 14 hours on our installation. I don't work as fast as my mechanic and he reminds me of that frequently. We originally intended to replace the old CHT gage with the JPI, but discovered the craftsmen at Downer curved the support behind the instrument panel so it wouldn't fit. I then opted to remove the ADF from the old glove compartment position and installed it there, so it took some time to get the project moving. The only extra bell we had was the fuel flow. All the proper parts were shipped which my mechanic says is a rarity for JPI.

I think the units could be more useful on fuel injected/GAMI type installation like the turbo-arrow might have. Those engines might be smooth enough that it could be difficult to get the optimum lean/rich of peak operation. For carbureted engines it main advantage would be as a troubleshooting device. For me, the fuel flow part is the best part so far, (I have original fuel gages, and never tusted any fuel gage anyway), once you figure out how to program it, it is "dead on", even better than my watch and fuel burn estimates, which were only good at the long range cruise setting I used. I would have bought a standalone fuel flow unit long ago if I understood how good they are. They can be wired into many GPS units to provide fuel at destination as well.

The JPI has preset/programable limits that when exceeded causes the unit to start flashing. When nothing is flashing the thing is a novel curiosity that should be ignored for the most part.

I haven't had a chance to download data on my computer yet, I’m just barely getting smart enough to program the thing.

There was a pretty good article in a recent EAA magazine explaining how useless the wiz bang info on EGTs that's provided by the engine analyzers.

Got 10 hours on the engine so far, it seems to be running well so hopefully I got a good overhaul. :D
 
I had installed a EI UBG-16, with the idea it would help with leaning out the engine more accurately and giving me more confident in mine setting. After about 5 hrs of ops I still looking for the confidence, I agree the information it provide is less valuable than the sells pitch.. It has not be very consistence nor have the setting (mixture) be consistent using the procedures outlined. On a positive note I also installed an EI fuel flow computer which has been a real mind easer in confirming the fuel tank fuel guage. It has been very accurate. It has help with mixture setting/ fuel flow readings. I have not yet set up any of the warnings.. I have a Garmin 300xl which should have the ability to down load the fuel flow rate and calculate the reminder at the waypoint but have not been able to wire the two together. The U-16 doubtful value the FP-5L is great.

Matt
 
I love having a 6 cyl EGT/CHT, for its trouble shooting value. I have found that on Carbureted engines, I always have RPM fall off BEFORE I get to peak EGT. Since I have a Horizon digital tach, I watch both the tach and the EGT, and when I see/feel the RPM fall off, I glance over to the EGT and enrichen approx 100 degrees. If I kept leaning, the EGT continues to go up...but I don't want to go there. I have seen this on both Lycoming and Franklin engines. I do not use the egt by itself to set the rpm. It is a great instrument for telling me problems in the engine. It tells you right away which spark plug may be fouling, and makes changing them much quicker, and may alleviate having to remove the cowls.
Not sure if this is a repeat of a previous message...if so, please attribute to advancing senility! Larry
 
Back
Top