Hydraulic Gear on 14-19 red light issue

B

Billy Walker

New member
We have a 14-19 with an IO-470 conversion that looks and flies GREAT. However, we have a couple of issues needing to be resolved.

1. We have a red unsafe light on all the time when the gear is up.
2. The elevator tab is not tight. There is some slight play which potentially can vibrate at higher speeds.

Are there replacement switches for the gear available? Are there replacement bushings for the trim tab available?

Thanks, and Blue Skies & Tailwinds...

Billy Walker

The N-6RJ Group
 
Billy:

Sounds like you have a spirited bird there (260hp in a 14-19).

The trim tab has an AD for the precise reason you mentioned: flutter. To the ground-bound world the word flutter sounds innocuous...even cute. To us it can mean sudden death. I don't have the AD in front of me but it involves applying fabric tape in an S pattern to the tab and its attachment. Plus you need to shore up the mechanical linkage to within specific tolerances. We have some fine A&P/IA triple tail owners on this list (oh, Lynnnnn :)) who could provide further detail.

I don't know if the current Bellanca factory has the microswitches you want but it's worth contacting them http://www.bellanca-aircraft.com/

I am not familiar with the switches that control the panel lights, alas.

Jonathan
 
Thanks for the info. We contacted Alexandria and they are sending a switch as well as the drawings for the trim (if they can find 'em!)....

Blue Skies & Tailwinds...

Billy
 
Billy Boy. I need a bit more info. When the gear is up the lights for the gear should be RED. In my 14-19-2 the gear has 2 green lights when down and locked, as soon as the drag links break on retraction the lights go out and the gear goes into the wells. When the gear is up and locked into the wells, the lights go red. So I have 4 lights, 2 green ,2 red ,how about you?
The trim tab is allowed about 20% play which is excessive. Just replace the Taper pin AN 386-1-6A, An975-3 washer, An 364-1032 nut and An 21-10A bolts. You have to be going 180 mph to develope flutter so if your bird is that fast I need to know your secrets! :? The Bellancas were very over rated with speed old corporate BS I guess my bird goes 145 mph at 23 sq average about 132 knots. How about You? :shock: Lynn N9818B the crate
 
Thanks for the input.

We have two green and ONE red light for the gear. As we understand the hydraulic gear operation, red is the transient or unlocked indication. There are proximity switches for the gear up and down and we ordered two from Alexandria along with the drawings for the trim tab.

It vibrates at 160 knots, so we keep it under that albiet it will consistently give us 167 knots ground speed in light winds. At 23 square we indicate 147 knots.

Roland Joslyn did a lot of work with smoothing things up when he did the IO-470 conversion. He used the micro-balloon process in glassing the wings.

If we can resolve the gear and trim tab issues, the aircraft will only need an interior fresh-up.

Send me your e-mail address and I will trade you photos.

BillyWalker@cox.net
 
Billy:

Lynn is right, red means up and locked. It certainly is on my 14-19. My wings too received the microballoon treatment and the airplane is pretty straight. I have the original 190hp O-435 engine and while I cannot climb with my buddy's -2, we both cruise at the same speed - 160mph (140kts).

However the fuel burn can get to be bizarre in a hurry in an O-435. Were I to try to keep up with a pre-201 Mooney, I'd have to burn 14 very expensive gallons every damned hour. Thus on long trips, I turn up the music, go high, throttle back, lean carefully, and I can get 130kts at 11 gal/hr.

I used to see a fellow at Blakesburg, Iowa every year with a smooth cream colored 'Master, micro-balogna wings, wing root farings, a slick glass cowl, fully enclosed landing gear, and an IO470. He boasted a cruise speed of 175mph (not knots). Given that drag is a square function, his getting 15mph more than I with 70 more horsepower did not seem crazy to me. I never got to talk with this fellow much, as he VERY MUCH hated conversation with strangers. Last time I saw him I managed to get "I have to sell this airplane...getting divorced." out of him before he slammed the door. Imagine my surprise :)

Pardon my long walk around the patch to get to this, but I'm sorry Billy; unless you mean miles per hour instead of knots, I simply do not believe you. Vikings may be 160kt airplanes, or even 165. Not that it matters what I believe. I'm no one special, and most folks fib about the cruise speed of their airplanes.

Jonathan
 
My goodness, Billy, you have the very modified 'Master I just described.

http://www.russellw.com/photoalbum/photo_query_results.asp?qManufacturer=eBellanca&qModel=c14%2D19&qLocation=cBlakesburg

Jonathan
 
Johathan, I am sending you a direct e-mal with some photos. However, seeing is believing. So, I will take some photos of the instruments in flight and offer those to the Doubting Thomases...

As for you, my friend, why not fly that beautiful 14-19 of yours out to Phoenix and I will demonstrate the aircraft's performance to you... :D
 
You're on, Billy :) The Arid Zone has some magnificent country to see from a GA airplane. I've crossed it in my Luscombe once and once in my Bellanca. The benefit of doing so in the winter is fewer dust devils stationed on the approach end of the runway :shock:

Skepticism makes a poor way to say hello, and I'm normally far more polite than that. Only the Navion has more strange speed claims based on various mods than our triple tails.

Jonathan
 
Billy, You can probably credit some of that speed to your wheel fairings. Do you possibly have any info on them or paperwork ? Duane
 
Hi Duane,

Sorry! Roland Joslyn had a fire which burned ALL his stuff. I ordered a CD from the FAA, but nothing has arrived as yet...

Blue Skies & Tailwinds...

Billy
 
I hate to be the one to alway bring this up, but Billy's Bellanca's speed has more to do with having seventy more horsepower than when it was manufactured in 1950. The wings were microballooned, the fit and finish are impecable and, despite all of this it does not make the advertised speed of the original 14-19.

Okay, so every aircraft manufacturer lied about such things. Point is that wheel farings are not proven speed mods. The protruding wheels disrupt the high speed surface under the wings. Wheel pants on Cirrus or Lancairs are different as the wings away from the wings. The farings on Billy's wings are probably modified Cessna wheel pants. They look good on his Bellanca, and if you like the look more power to you. At best, though, you'll realize 3mph at most.

Jonathan
 
N6RJ has arrived in its new home, August 28th, New Carlise, Ohio. The flight from CHD to Dalhart Texas was accomplised at 11,500. Indicated airspeed was 126kts, OAT was 15c. 19.5in map, 2450rpm. 43 gal of fuel used on this leg, whiz wheel says TAS 156kts, not much wind that day ground speed on the GPS averaged 158-160kts.

Second Leg Dalhart, Texas to Columbia, MO, 11,500, 15c and 126 kts indicated, 40 gallons of fuel used. GPS about 157kts.

Third leg to 3OH0, was about 0245 enroute, same altitude of 11500, 126 kts indicated, 15c. TAS 156. Ground speed on the GPS the same.

Dan Schultz
Tipp City, Ohio
 
Outstanding, Dan!

I see you've also had the 260hp Continental installed on your 14-19. Funny thing is that your engine probably burns less fuel than my WWII surplus O-435 to achieve 15-20kts more speed. Well...it's not all that funny when I refuel :)

Congratulations :!: :!:

Jonathan
 
Thanks Jonathan! Red light is still an issue, need to adjust it, the aircraft was modified when the gear is up the light is out, Roland changed it to a gear transit light.

Dan
 
Oops...I as a bit slow on the uptake here, Dan. You bought Billy's 'Master...somehow I thought you'd purchased another 14-19 with gobs of added horsepower. Lots of folks have put O470s in their 14-19s over the years. Then again, few have added the 260hp version of the IO470.

I'd be tempted too, but I'd have to dump the original cowl which I love. Plus I figure it's nice to have at least a few original 14-19s out there...just so long as I don't see you blow past me one of these days :)

Jonathan
 
Have you checked to see if it's the microswitch (assuming in modifying it he used the same (similar) switch by changing it from N.O. to N.C. (it think those are the two choices) (they would then have to figure out how to have it work with the down switch so it was only lit while in transit) It could just be a matter of adjusting the little tab up near the trunnion that hits the switch.
 
The Viking is set up with the red light on only when the gear is unsafe. as in during transit. I like it that way. I have a friend with a 14-19-2 that the lite stays on and at night it drives me crazy seeing it all the time. :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
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